Comments on: Top reasons why gujjar protest is illegitimate

By: Ayam

Ayam — Thu, 24 Sep 2009 04:08:00 +0000

hi,all
First of all gujjar are not tribe or adibasi and means are not too. The only tribe in rajasthans are vill and some others smaller groups.To give the ST status to means are also faults and are not faier to the villa and others, so it is better to put the means to the OBC n rise some percentage of OBC quota is the most fearier option as i think, hoping for kind respons .
Ayam

By: Ranu Aggarwal

Ranu Aggarwal — Tue, 19 Aug 2008 03:26:01 +0000

What avenues has the Indian Political and Bueraucratic Establishment made available to people with lack of resources to get ahead in life besides a draconian reservation system of quotas in government jobs and colleges, that you would consider the gujjar demand illegitimate who are hurting because their traditional sources of livelihood (mostly subsistence agriculture) are disappearing due to water shortages and changing climate.

Maybe the Gujjars do not have the imagination to see any other way out of their predicament but reservation quotas for being able to survive, but to have idiotic government leadership at both the State and the Center level who do not have the ability to even identify the problem correctly is a tragedy.

It is a sad day in 61 years of our so called democracy when we can find the time to still cry about Jalia walan bagh but not raise an eyebrow when the tax payer funded police shoot to kill unarmed protestors, who have no choice but to disrupt life in the face of a political and bueraucratic culture totally unresponsive to people’s need unless they are disruptive.

By: Top reasons why violent protest in kashmir should be surpressed | Open Source Blogging

Mon, 18 Aug 2008 04:16:17 +0000

[...] Top reasons why gujjar protest is illegitimate [...]

By: Ch. Muhammad Ashraf Gujjar,

Ch. Muhammad Ashraf Gujjar, — Thu, 24 Jul 2008 16:12:40 +0000

Gujar Places In Pakistan

The thousands of places were named after the Gujjars and their sub-tribes in the Sub-Continent during the period they ruled over the South and some part of Central Asia. In these days an interesting discussion is going on as to who the Gujjars or Gurjars are? I am mentioning the name of some places situated in all the four provinces of Pakistan. This do not include the villages named after the Gujjars situated in Jammu & Kashmir, Northern Areas and the Tribal Areas. I will updating the visitors of this site after I complete the data in respect of these areas. I will also try my best some time later to provide the name of villages after the sub-tribes of Gujjars. The following data will help the analysts and historians to draw some befitting and logical conclusion.
I will be highly obliged if any brethren may add to my knowledge by mentioning such places named after the word Gujar, Gujjar or Gurjar, situated in India or any other part of the world. Kindly forward this despatch to other sites discussing the Gujjar’s dilema.
Regards

Ch. Muhammad Ashraf Gujjar,
Advocate High Court,
m_ashraf777@hotmail.com

P U N J A B PROVINCE:

DERA GHAZI KHAN DISTRICT
THOKH GUJRI

LAYYAH DISTRICT
GUJRAT

MUZAFFARGARH DISTRICT
GUJARWALA

RAJANPUR DISTRICT
KOTLA GOJAR
GUJAR WALI

FAISALABAD DISTRICT
CHAK 217/GB GUJJAR PIND
CHAK 176/GB PALA GOJRA

JHANG DISTRICT
JAT GUJJAR

TOBA TEK SINGH DISTRICT
GOJRA TEHSIL

GUJRANWALA DISTRICT
KOTLI GUJRAN

GUJRAT DISTRICT
GUJARPUR
DHOK GUJRAN
GUJJAR KOTLA
KULEWAL GUJRAN
KHANPUR GUJRAN

HAFIZABAD DISTRICT
GUJRANWALI
GUJAR KE

MANDI BAHAUDDIN DISTRICT
GOJRA

NAROWAL DISTRICT
GUJAR WALI
BHABRA GUJRAN
BERA GUJRAN
KHANPUR GUJRAN
CHHANI GUJRAN
DEHLA GUJRAN
PAILA GUJRAN
GUJAR TOOR
HAJI PUR GUJRAN
DARYA GUJRAN
KOTLI GUJRAN
BADALA GUJRAN
NIKI GUJRAN
JHOMIAN GUJRAN
GUJRAT
NADALA GUJRAN
BALA GUJRAN
BHERON CHAK GUJRAN
TEHRA GUJRAN

SIALKOT DISTRICT
GUJARKE
GOJRA
GUJAR KALLA
GUJAR GORAYA
GUJRAL
GUJRAN WALA

KASUR DISTRICT
GURJKE

LAHORE DISTRICT
NAWAN PIND GUJRAN
HANDU GUJAR
QILA GUJAR SINGH
WARRA GUJARAN

OKARA DISTRICT
GHOUS PUR GUJJRAN

SHEIKHUPURA DISTRICT
GUJAR PURA
MAHMOON GUJAR
KALA GUJAR
KOTLI GUJRAN
RATTA GUJRAN

VEHARI DISTRICT
GUJAR

ATTOCK DISTRICT
THATTI GUJRAN
DHOK GUJAR

CHAKWAL DISTRICT
BHATTI GUJAR
MOHRA GUJRAN
PINDI GUJRAN

JHELUM DISTRICT
WARA GUJRAN
GUJER PUR
KALA GUJRAN
THATHI GUJRAN
GUJJAR
GUJAR KATARIAN

RAWALPINDI DISTRICT
GUJAR KHAN TEHSIL
GOJRA
MATUA GUJAR
DHANGDEW GUJAR MAL
JAND GUJAR
GURAH GUJARAN
PHAMRA GUJRAN
KALA GUJRAN
BHANGALI GUJAR
ARAZI GUJRAL
DHOK GUJRI
BHADANA GUJRAN
DANDI GUJRAN
KHURAM GUJAR

MIANWALI DISTRICT
GUJRAN WALA
GUJRAT

KHUSHAB DISTRICT
GUJRANWALA

North Western Frontier Province(N. W. F. P.)

D. I. KHAN DISTRICT
GUJRAT
ABBOTTABAD DISTRICT
MASAH GUJRI
GUJRI
BAIN GUJRI
HARIPUR DISTRICT
PIND GUJRAN
MOHRRA GUJAR
KOHISTAN DISTRICT
GUJJAR BANDA
GUJARYBAKE
GUJAR KHEL
GUJAR BANDA
GUJAR BANDA
MANSEHRA DISTRICT
GUJRAN
GUJRA
GUJRAN DE GAL
LOWER DIR DISTRICT
GUJAR KALAI
GUJAR ABAD
UPPER DIR DISTRICT
GUJARA KILI
GUJAR LALA
MALA-GUJAR
MARDAN DISTRICT
GUJRAT
GUJAR GARHI
Mohalla GUJARAN
Bakhshali
PESHAWAR DISTRICT
CHOUHA GUJAR
MIAN GUJAR

S I N D PROVINCE

KARACHI DISTRICT GUJAR CHOWK,
Manzoor Colony
Gujjar Nallah

BADIN DISTRICT
GUJRI
LARKANA DISTRICT
GUJHAR
SANGHAR DISTRICT
GUJRO
GUJHERAN
GUJHRO
SUKKUR DISTRICT
GUJRO

B A L U C H I S T A N PROVINCE

AWARAN DISTRICT
GUJARO
KHUZDAR DISTRICT
GUJAAR
BOLAN DISTRICT
GUJAR
PISHIN DISTRICT
GUJIR
DERA BUGTI DISTRICT
GUJRO
ZHOB DISTRICT
GURJE ZAI

ISLAMABAD CAPITAL TERRITORY (I.C.T.)

KANGOTA GUJRAN
DERA GUJARAN (SECTOR G-10)
GOHRRA GUJARAN
MARRI GUJAR, TALHARR.

By: hamid khan

hamid khan — Sat, 21 Jun 2008 05:58:45 +0000

why social deprivation is still here even if reservation has been implemented for the last 60 years……..
bcoz starting was not so absolute …………
by giving reservation on social deprivation,u r still realising them that ,particular person is from lower class and other one is from higher class.
so mission for eradicating social deprivation has been failed.

by implementing “HARIGAN ACT ” u can only shut the mouth of higher
class but what about felling .

as u know that in INDIA ,reservation is the favourite van by which u can go up to hight but what about sociality,they r still fighting?/
so we should take the recommendation of “MADHBAN MEMON COMMITTE” for anti discrimination:
that reservation should not be based on one’s CASTE,SEX,RELIGION.
but should be reflection of one’economic index.

and one more imp thing, parameter for economic index should be made such that no one could cheat ………….

bye

By: chakresh

chakresh — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 10:16:55 +0000

This is so true that wrong implementation of reservation has created a lot of problems. But saying that there is no social deprivation is also a grossly wrong statement. It is true that in urban areas nowadays people do not care for one’s caste and economic level is more important factor. But the villages (65% india) are still very much in grip of this problem. People of higher caste do not abuse a lower caste person due to fear of “Harijan Act” etc., But they do not like to maintain an equal relationship either and the bigger problem is that lower caste people know this mentality, which finally results in social deprivation. I belong to a so called upper caste and have seen this in my own village.
Surely urban areas are better in this parameter, but there also are many people, who do not want to eat at any lower caste home. This is why we still need some tool to fight social deprivation.
Implementing reservation on economic basis is not a very good idea practically as it is very easy to fake your economic condition document than caste document. You must have seen people taking improper advantage of mean cum merit scholarships.
So, what I am saying is that implementation is surely faulty, but not the concept.
I can surely give you example of caste upward movement. Yadavs, Lodhs in UP are now much more respected than 50 years ago due to reservation and other benefits.

By: Abhishek Shukla

Abhishek Shukla — Fri, 20 Jun 2008 09:59:41 +0000

I do agree that reservation on the basis of social deprivation would be worst criteria for eligibility, it make no sense in current scenario as mentioned above nowadays people have been so mixed in main stream, its very hard to recognize the status n condition of a person on the basis of his/her caste. Also please tell me single caste that after applying reservation for about 60 years have become “forward” from “backward”.

So its looks like solution is found we should apply reservation on the basis of financial condition and all will be happy except politician but there is little problem, today I am writing to a forum where people are discussing if any caste’s demand on review for definition of backwardness of castes is right or wrong and I am very sure if we apply reservation on the basis of poorness then after some years there would be a forum where people would be discussing whether someone’s demand for review of his poorness is right or wrong, look what happened because of reservation, I don’t know whether gujjars are sc/st or obc but one thing I can see is that one is willing to declare itself more backward if it can get more privileged, if the purpose of reservation was to lift social economic status of “historically backward” then just look what happened.

I think every one understands how dangerous this demand is, if completed then it will trigger chain reaction and if denied still will ensure such demands will go frequent now, my friends these are the reasons why I oppose whole idea of reservation, reservation is just a tool to help country grow in balanced way but this tool failed badly because of human psyche of looking for free meals. What purpose this tool serves, if one MLA is elected it gives profit to only one family instead if we open one school with good facilities that can make sure students studying in it can compete with students of private schools then it will uplift hundreds of families, why should not every child born in India have confidence that it doesn’t matter what his caste is, what is financial status of his parents is, only thing matters is he is citizen of India and this fact alone is sufficient to ensure he will get equal opportunities to build his life, he doesn’t need reservation, he needs equal opportunity.

By: hamid khan

hamid khan — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 09:11:52 +0000

hi
>>”Gujjars are not eligible for sc/st, because they are not tribe. I support reservation for genuine tribes. These two are not contradicting statements dear. ”
**it is true that,in rajasthan the gujjar,s are not tribes(but in jk,hp they are).
being only sc/st should be eligibility for getting reservation in your view
their present condition means nothing……

“>>30 MLA’s are from many tribal groups in total not from one of them.”

** majority are from only one types………

>>” The whole idea of reservation is based on social deprivation, which depends on community’s history and current situation both”"

** why reservation and who are the eligibles
at the time of independence ,social deprivation was one of the finnest way to do that and to make mass of india dynamic and to contribute in development of economy of INDIA.
But presently it is not the case,
DEPRIVATION is not directly prop to sociality…….
so parameter should change for reservation should be free from their
historical background…….

still more later………

bye

By: RAW-MAN

RAW-MAN — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 21:04:34 +0000

I am quite agree with Hamid Khan…

You are saying thr are 30 MLAs frm so called tribe groups. tell me one thing how the hell these 30 MLA’s families are eligible for 15% reservation.

i totally accept dat may be forefathers of these 30 family were in very poor conditions but it make no sense to giving these families this kind of support today.

This is just an example of a very big flaw in our reservation system.

I don’t think there are more then 4-5 caste, in which whole junta, belong to dat caste, need reservation. Man… we are living in 21st century and things have now changed a lot. nowdays ppl have been so mixed in main stream, its very hard to recognize the status n condition of a person on the basis of his/her caste.

Sometimes i do agree with the fact that there are still some families [hardly there'll be more than 4-5 caste or groups] in India who need reservation or one can say reservation help them some way or other. But in that case there must be some other factors like TAI [total annual income/property] to make the basis of reservation.

>>i am very shocked that being a educated person ,u still compare
people on basis of their history……..

>>|>>We have to. The whole idea of reservation is based on social deprivation, which depends on community’s history and current situation both.

Tell me one things in current scenario what is the significance of so called reservation basis “social deprivation”.
this whole idea of social deprivation is BIG SHIT. thr is no sense to compare ppl on the basis of their castes.. one side government oppose castesim n on the other hand government is comparing ppl on the basis thr caste.
WOW… isn’t dat sound gr8 shit.

By: sid

sid — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 16:02:33 +0000

i completely agree with u …………keep it up !!……. what do u think about this blog http://sidspeaks190.blogspot.com …….its on the same issue

By: chakresh

chakresh — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:25:24 +0000

>>”one side u r saying that gujjar’s hv nt eligible for reservation and on other side u r in support of sc/st reservation only account of their history.”

Gujjars are not eligible for sc/st, because they are not tribe. I support reservation for genuine tribes. These two are not contradicting statements dear.

>>why u are nt comparing them in present context means their social economical status.In Rajasthan more than 30 MLA’s r from ST communitY and gujjar hv only near about fifth of their.

30 MLA’s are from many tribal groups in total not from one of them.

>>i am very shocked that being a educated person ,u still compare
people on basis of their history……..

We have to. The whole idea of reservation is based on social deprivation, which depends on community’s history and current situation both.
See you later Hamid.

By: hamid khan

hamid khan — Tue, 17 Jun 2008 12:13:21 +0000

hi
sitting in front of computer and writing any thing is always a complex thing
for the reader that what u want to say?one side u r saying that gujjar’s hv nt eligible for reservation and on other side u r in support of sc/st reservation only account of their history.
why u are nt comparing them in present context means their social economical status.In Rajasthan more than 30 MLA’s r from ST communitY and gujjar hv only near about fifth of their.

i am very shocked that being a educated person ,u still compare
people on basis of their history……..

still more later

hamid khan

By: chakresh

chakresh — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:52:43 +0000

yes abhishek I completly agree with over issue of bandh and all, but I do support SC/ST reservation

By: Abhishek Shukla

Abhishek Shukla — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 14:48:24 +0000

I do not support any sort of reservation, if any section is weak then government should provide support to it but not privilege and if after giving support (same opportunity in education and financial support), it still can not compete with other sections then probably they doesn’t worth of support.

And the habit of vandalism and harming national property in the name democratic right should be strictly discouraged, the leaders who initiate these “aandolans and band ” should be held responsible for any harm to national property and they should be forced to compensate all damage as penalty and criminal case should be lodged against them. They should made to fill fine for not only direct damage to properties but also for all the damage that occurred due to disruption of transportation and other disruptions that occurred because of there so called “band”.